DF 150 2008 Water in oil

[gambler2101]

I just picked up a 08 DF 150 with 300 hours that has water in the oil. I dont know the history of the motor but the previous owner broke a plug in the number 3 cylinder trying to change it and gave up on it. I pulled the power head and removed the head but found no obvious hole in the block or head. The head is straight as is the block I put a straight edge on both. I cant see where water was getting past the head gasket. I have looked all over and can not find where the water was coming from. The head had to come off anyway to remove the broken plug but I do not want to spend the money on gaskets only to get water in the oil again. Anyone who works on these motors regularly run into this before that can tell me what or where to look. From the reading I have done it seems that there was a problem with the plug on the side of the motor corroding but I think that was prior to 08 mine looks ok. There is an allen screw in the bottom of the water passage in the head its ugly but not through the block into the oil pan. Side cover is fine as is the front cover. The front cover had a lot of scale in it but no hole. It cleaned up fine. Just hoping someone has dealt with this before and can save me some time and hassle. Thanks for your time








this is the allen screw coming from the bottom of the head into the water passage it looks perfect on the bottom

[gambler2101]

[gambler2101]

[gambler2101]

[artdf175]

Since you have it this far apart
What does the inside of the oil pan expose ?
I have a 2006 175 that shares the same frame as the 150
There was a couple of holes that was allowing cooling water to run into exhaust creating an overheating at idle problem
So would inspect the oil pan for corrosion problems
I think the plug on the side that had corrosion problems was an earlier 140 engine
The #3 & #4 look suspect in two ways
With the oil I would suspect valve stem seal failures
And the the head gasket
From the photos, which are really good by the way, the gasket appears to have been good on the valve cover side but to me anyway the side against the block looks like a little suspect
There are some really good mechanics on the forum that I suspect will chime in
Art

[gambler2101]

I have not really gone over the oil pan other than where the exhaust runs through since it has water passages. I didnt see any breach where water could be entering the exhaust. After not finding a hole anyplace I figured it would have to be a warped head but it is dead straight. The head gasket does not have any obvious sign of breach like missing material or discoloration that I can see. Yes its the number 3 and 4 that are getting water mainly 3 it seems. If the plug was not broken off in 3 I would have done a leak down test prior to pulling it apart but it had to come down in order to remove the broken plug. I am thinking of having the head decked and putting it back together. I just hate spending so much money and not knowing for sure where the water was getting in. I was hoping that someone else has dealt with the exact same thing before and could point me in the right direction.

Did your oil pan have a hole corroded thorough it? Were you getting water in your oil or just overheating due to a breach in the exhaust? Thanks

[artdf175]

the oil pan ended up a with 2 holes corroded through
one a very thin wall was behind the plate that has the fresh water flush out fitting on the port side..
the other was internal both between the water and exhaust
I suppose if it there was a hole between water and oil.. you would have a pretty good trail of oil out the exhaust system with the discharge water

I started with an oil consumption problem.. a 10 hour tuna trip consumed a quart of oil.. no visible signs of leakage..
so a year ago with about 500 hours ..finally found a mechanic I could trust and rebuilt the engine.. Did great work and fixed oil issue..
After the break in period .. took it out for a tuna trip.. 2 hours of running.. pulled back to idle to get gear deployed. off goes the overheat alarm.. higher revs kept enough water to power head to keep it cool..
so back to the mechanic.. did all the usual check points and nothing.. he got a hold of a mechanic in Seattle than used to work for Suzuki.. and he told him where to look .. and sure enough .. that is where he found the breaches .. Suzuki has not had any TSB's on this "known" problem.
will look back and add links for the 2 threads I did on these issues
Art..

[artdf175]

links

http://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/s...006-df175.html

http://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/s...5-results.html

http://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/s...e-results.html

see if you can gather anything from these
Art

[gambler2101]

Thanks for the links Art, I would like to give mine a real good check while I have it apart. I cant for the life of me find a breach in the powerhead or the head so I am at a loss. Thanks

[artdf175]

the second hole was more difficult to get a picture of
but was between the wall of the water jacket and the small exhaust vent at the back of the engine. it is suppose to be the exhaust relief when you are in reverse .. so water pressure at the prop hub can let exhaust escape through this vent vs building up in the engine
maybe you can see it in the attached the round hole is where the plastic type fitting is.. from this hole there is short "S" hose that goes to the plastic fitting that you see on the back of the motor ..

[gambler2101]

Art thanks for the pictures. Were you getting water in your oil also?

[artdf175]

No did not have the oil/water problem
As I pointed out in he rebuild - did end up rebuilding the head
At first we thought we could use about half the valves but I then thought better of it and rebuilt it with all new parts
Was well worth it
I ended with essentially a brand new engine that is around 25% more efficient

[Solarman]

Granted I'm not as familiar with the 4 strokes, but that first pic you posted, looks like a small crack,or more? Looking through the mirror? If that is the exhaust pas-sage/ chamber through the midsection, it should also have a water jacket all around it. The water would be under pressure, if through? May be squirting upwards to exhaust-valves, getting in lower cylinders?

Just thoughts, good pics, tried to put a red arrow/line in the area I'm mentioning. Not talented with technologies, lol.

Good luck.

[artdf175]

Solarman I am seeing what you see but believe that is just a shadow
However the photos with the round mirror, am I picking up a crack in the upper half above the (spark plug?) hole?
Art

Granted I'm not as familiar with the 4 strokes, but that first pic you posted, looks like a small crack,or more? Looking through the mirror? If that is the exhaust pas-sage/ chamber through the midsection, it should also have a water jacket all around it. The water would be under pressure, if through? May be squirting upwards to exhaust-valves, getting in lower cylinders?

Just thoughts, good pics, tried to put a red arrow/line in the area I'm mentioning. Not talented with technologies, lol.

Good luck.

[gambler2101]

The plug in the exhaust is made from steel but does not have a hole in it. The gasket was fully intact and no sign of water getting pass. From what I read they changed to a aluminum plug in 08 and my motor is an 08. So I guess they must have had some overlap where they still used the steel plug.









Art the picture with the round mirror is the worst spot in the block. It is were there is a allen screw from the bottom of the oil pan into the block where the cooling is located just below the bottom piston. Not sure of whey it is made this way but it is also not breached at this point, its ugly from the water passage but perfect from the pan. Water is not making its way into the pan from here.



I have now gone over the pan and holder and see nothing there either. The hose that looks like a bypass for the exhaust was melted where it went into the back of the mid section. I dont see any way water could have gone back into the pan from here either but I will replace the bad part while I have it apart.




this is the side covers on the engine holder they are in very good condition also.

I can not find a single place where its obvious there is water intrusion due to a failure in the block head exhaust or side covers. I dropped the head at a machinist and he is decking it. I ran a straight edge across it and did not see where it was warped but I figured it must have been getting past the head gasket even though there is no evidence of it doing so.

I hate doing it but I will reassemble the motor with new gaskets and hope for the best. If it still is getting water I will be out some money on gaskets and a lot of my time but its better than just scraping the engine.

Maybe I am the first person to deal with this since no one else spoke up. I had hoped that a suzuki mechanic was on the board who would have seen the exact same issue before and would have been able to point me to the problem area. Thanks for the help Art I will post after I get it back together.